Whats the deal with CDJs?

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Whats the deal with CDJs?
Posted on: 07.12.2013 by Galen Fraile
Aside from the obvious fact that they're still the industry standard in clubs, which I get... Whats the appeal? For instance why would a new DJ go for the vastly bulkier and more expensive CDJs with an external mixer over say an all in one digital controller?
Hellen Mindrup
09.12.2013
Originally Posted by Nick V
Or maybe they'll be re-marketed as USBJ 2000s?
Lol, good thought.
Augustina Zulu
09.12.2013
Originally Posted by Sambo
....Seriously, Pio's marketing division deserves all the blowjobs and cookies that it gets. The biggest lie that people believe is that CDJs and controllers are different, when they aren't. They're both a series of components and buttons that play a music file, whether it be WAV, MP3, whatever.

You play for yourself and your audience, it doesn't matter what you use.
Unless some other company can learn to compete with the Pioneer marketing behemoth, I believe CDJs might be around longer than CDs. I mean who buys CDs these days? Sure we burn them but a thumb drive is far superior for getting bits of data off your PC. Or maybe they'll be re-marketed as USBJ 2000s?
Lawana Mileto
09.12.2013
Originally Posted by ConnectControl
Aside from the obvious fact that they're still the industry standard in clubs, which I get... Whats the appeal? For instance why would a new DJ go for the vastly bulkier and more expensive CDJs with an external mixer over say an all in one digital controller?
CDJ's are industry standard, and unless your playing big clubs, the dj booths aren't gonna be massive meaning there isn't that much room for someone with a controller, it's easier to rock up with some cd's/usb and play, no messing about.

The size of controllers is more of an issue than size of CDJ's and a mixer, unless your a mobile DJ where it could be a plus.

Personally I've never really enjoyed playing on CDJ's, do ocassionally play on them but only the odd track, but I would rather play on CDJ's than a controller.

The cost is probably why a lot of new dj's aren't going for CD's/Turntables, as yes it's a big first investment. But it will benefit you in the long run, especially if you do want to play clubs etc

Personally I'll be sticking with two turntables and a mixer.
Trula Willadsen
09.12.2013
Originally Posted by Sambo
Screw your vinyl, I play all my tracks with a 32-piece orchestra in a room with specially designed acoustic properties. If I have to change the speed, I have to instruct 32 people to do so in unison. Sure, to some level having your music recorded in an easy format for one person to play can definitely help you understand how to rock a party, but let me just take that vinyl away from you, how are you doing now? Yeah you can't conduct an orchestra for toffee can you?

What I'm trying to say is, saying he'd be screwed if he had to DJ with the standard of two decades ago is a moot point, because it isn't two decades ago, it's today. This is DJ Techtools, not DJ Yesterdaytools, so lets not get into a bashing session over irrational arguments.
I get what your saying, but the harsh truth is that if you want to be taken serious and want regular club gigs or even at festivals you'll need to learn how to operate CDJ's. There are actually festivals here in the Netherlands where they forbid the winners of DJ-contests who can play opening slots to use laptops.

That being said; I own the SX and love it to death! Play three gigs a week with em yet I'd still rather have 3 CDJ2K's and a DJM900... They're just more fun
Augustine Mitzen
09.12.2013		if i'd want to nitpick, i'd say controllers don't play anything, they're just an interface for your computer
Jetta Drenzek
09.12.2013		Screw your vinyl, I play all my tracks with a 32-piece orchestra in a room with specially designed acoustic properties. If I have to change the speed, I have to instruct 32 people to do so in unison. Sure, to some level having your music recorded in an easy format for one person to play can definitely help you understand how to rock a party, but let me just take that vinyl away from you, how are you doing now? Yeah you can't conduct an orchestra for toffee can you?

What I'm trying to say is, saying he'd be screwed if he had to DJ with the standard of two decades ago is a moot point, because it isn't two decades ago, it's today. This is DJ Techtools, not DJ Yesterdaytools, so lets not get into a bashing session over irrational arguments.

Back on topic, the deal with CDJs is simple, they were created to adapt the benefits of CDs into the DJing world. Pioneer, not keeping up with the very quickly advancing laptop DJ market (It was adopted waaaaay faster than the CDJs were) developed a genius marketing plan and made the CDJ what is referred to as a "Veblen good", which essentially means it can command a high price because it then carries an "elite" status. Not only do they not have to sell as many, they also earn titles like "Professional" and "Industry standard" which then makes them sell more. Also, almost every big name DJ/venue is given a CDJ set up for free. One example of this is Zedd, who started making waves and touring the festival circuit using Traktor and an S4, then when he was getting higher up the festival slot, he tweeted a picture of a brand new nexus set up that Pioneer had given to him. There are hundreds of DJs who are bigger or comparable to Zedd, so you can imagine how many units Pioneer give away to make sure they maintain their status whilst they try to catch up to the controller market.

Which they are doing quite well! The DDJ-SX is undoubtedly one of the best controllers you can buy, and whilst expensive, for once with Pioneer you're actually getting what you pay for. Also they've pre-empted the upcoming tablet DJ movement by making the recordbox app compatible with the nexus range. Why bother taking your controller when you can take just your tablet, right?

Seriously, Pio's marketing division deserves all the blowjobs and cookies that it gets. The biggest lie that people believe is that CDJs and controllers are different, when they aren't. They're both a series of components and buttons that play a music file, whether it be WAV, MP3, whatever.

You play for yourself and your audience, it doesn't matter what you use.
Trula Willadsen
09.12.2013
Originally Posted by William Gibson
Not to get off on a wild tangent but saying just because DJ's Now a days visualize stuff and that's a "problem", is a pretty bold statement. I started DJ'ing a little over a year ago on some shitty numark CDJs. I had no music background, everything I read about song structure and things like phrasing didn't make much sense to me and learning was going very slow. It wasn't until I picked up a copy of Live and visually saw these beats, bars and the whole song structures that everything clicked. I believe I learned more about DJing and put more songs together better that first week with Live then I did the several months with just the CDJs. I'm a visual learner, to say that learning this way is detrimental to the DJ community as a whole is pretty absurd, IMO.

Just my .02
Sure, to some level it can definitely help you understand music better. But let me just take the screen away from you, how are you doing now? If you want to learn something, you have to learn the basics. Beatmatching without a screen while riding the pitch should def be one of those basics.

You've learned something from your screen, good for you! Now take it away and learn even more!
Ming Devis
08.12.2013
Originally Posted by William Gibson
Not to get off on a wild tangent but saying just because DJ's Now a days visualize stuff and that's a "problem", is a pretty bold statement. I started DJ'ing a little over a year ago on some shitty numark CDJs. I had no music background, everything I read about song structure and things like phrasing didn't make much sense to me and learning was going very slow. It wasn't until I picked up a copy of Live and visually saw these beats, bars and the whole song structures that everything clicked. I believe I learned more about DJing and put more songs together better that first week with Live then I did the several months with just the CDJs. I'm a visual learner, to say that learning this way is detrimental to the DJ community as a whole is pretty absurd, IMO.

Just my .02
It can definitely help using the wave forms to understand song structure. Doing it blind after you understand it can sharpen your skills even further and really get you feeling the musical changes.
Klara Kinnebrew
08.12.2013
Originally Posted by Student
Another point is; DJ's should be able to DJ by listening. Most new DJ's who start out DJ'ing don't do this by listening but by visualizing through their screens. They see whether tracks are matched or not. The actual sound doesn't matter anymore. That is becoming a bigger and bigger problem.
Not to get off on a wild tangent but saying just because DJ's Now a days visualize stuff and that's a "problem", is a pretty bold statement. I started DJ'ing a little over a year ago on some shitty numark CDJs. I had no music background, everything I read about song structure and things like phrasing didn't make much sense to me and learning was going very slow. It wasn't until I picked up a copy of Live and visually saw these beats, bars and the whole song structures that everything clicked. I believe I learned more about DJing and put more songs together better that first week with Live then I did the several months with just the CDJs. I'm a visual learner, to say that learning this way is detrimental to the DJ community as a whole is pretty absurd, IMO.

Just my .02
Vikki Falkenrath
08.12.2013		Without Rekordbox CDJs are the most reliable gear for DJing.
Ming Devis
08.12.2013		I believe CDJ's are great (only used Pioneer). Very intuitive and the 2000's at least feel very natural to mix on going between vinyl and USB. The gripe I have with the kit is the price. 2000 plus dollars for one is out of my price range. Traktor with DVS takes up less space and money for my home set up as I already have 1200's. I spin mostly vinyl now so I'm not fussed with bringing my sound card and laptop out and instead just rekord box some tunes onto a usb and play off the cdj's.

I'm interested in what Pioneer will do with the 850. If the price is right and the features are there I might get a set. I'm not a big fan of the A10's phono pre amps.
Shan Bauerly
08.12.2013		They look and feel far more legit. They are robust and autonomous. And the farther you can get from directly playing computers, the better off you are. But mostly, they just feel better.
Yuonne Losure
08.12.2013		Reasons why someone would want CDJs + external mixer over an all-in-one:

- Wants to be used to them for playing out. The better you know the gear the more second nature things become. Not really required, as you can learn to use them pretty quick if you play out enough, but it can be helpful, especially if you don't have a vinyl beat matching background.

- Wants to use an external mixer. This is the biggest reason to use them in my opinion. No piece of gear gives me greater joy in mixing then a great sounding mixer with excellent ergonomics. I still haven't seen any controllers with great mixing sections, or even what I'd consider good ones, and I definitely haven't heard any with great sound quality. I'm picky about my mixers, and I want what I love playing on for mixing. While I'm obviously going to play on whatever mixer is at a gig, for events that I throw (I've been throwing parties for 15 years), I want MY mixer. While this doesn't mean you have to use CDJs in your home setup, assuming you are using software there aren't that many single deck controllers out there with great pitch adjust controls (needed to learn how to manually beat match when you play on CDJs) and tight software integration allowing easy beat matching (ie most use MIDI which doesn't allow high pitch resolution). However, you can use you CDJs as controllers - the older models through DVS systems and the newer Pioneers direct via Midi (in which case also practice with regular CDs so you learn beat matching) or HID (gives you the pitch resolution you need for manual beat matching using software).
Lakeesha Storman
09.12.2013
Originally Posted by Student
Another point is; DJ's should be able to DJ by listening. Most new DJ's who start out DJ'ing don't do this by listening but by visualizing through their screens. They see whether tracks are matched or not. The actual sound doesn't matter anymore. That is becoming a bigger and bigger problem.
This.

As one who was recently bitten by the vinyl mixing bug, I've learned so much more about music and the music I like and am mixing at the moment because I'm forced to listen not only to beat match but also to get the music phrased correctly. Yeah, it's hella harder, even then I imagined because I "knew the concepts" but it 1) makes you appreciate people who DJ this way 2) gets you more in touch with the music you're spinning and 3) makes you a much better DJ IMO.

I recently had a discussion with a friend about a mix she'd done where she brought in the new song on the third measure of the 8 measure "musical phrase" which just sounded off to me. I explained this to her and she couldn't grasp it because it was beat matched, (she uses sync) so I had to step-by-step explain to her musical phrasing. So she finally figured it out, said she'd been listening to mixes on soundcloud while actually counting the beats now (which I tried to explain to her deaf ears when she first began mixing) and is amazed at the differences musical phrasing makes. And phrasing is just one example...knowing your songs inside and out helps immensely as well. While cue points, loops, etc can be done on some CDJs, not all of them and certainly not vinyl.
Alyse Chiong
07.12.2013		Also if you like manual beat matching it feels much easier on CDJ's rather than say an S2, I can beatmatch well on CDJ's but cannot for the life of me on a controller.
Olin Easley
07.12.2013		I learnt on a Mixtrack Pro (still have that at home), but I use CDJs at clubs. It doesn't matter what you use at home, the principle of DJing is always the same.
Augustine Mitzen
07.12.2013		because they're quite reliable and hassle free
Trula Willadsen
07.12.2013		The deal is that DJ booths are small, so when you have more than 1 artist playing on a evening you don't want to switch up different settings. Easiest would be to just insert your USB's or SD's and take over. Another point is; DJ's should be able to DJ by listening. Most new DJ's who start out DJ'ing don't do this by listening but by visualizing through their screens. They see whether tracks are matched or not. The actual sound doesn't matter anymore. That is becoming a bigger and bigger problem.

Yeah you can buy a car with an automatic transmission, but you still did have to learn how to shift gears manually, right? (ok, maybe not in the US you lazy bastards, but for most parts of the world they have I suppose )
Hellen Mindrup
07.12.2013		And they're big and fun to play with, kinda like my… Nvm.

CDJ's #juan
Hank Guidas
07.12.2013		And you don't have to drag a laptop around.
Petra Arra
07.12.2013		Cdj appeals to a certain group just like the turntables appeal scratch djs. Its a matter of preference. Plus. You'll have familiarity with the gear when you play in clubs.

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